In Part One of their discussion of 1974’s “The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway,” the Tabletop joined Rael as his journey took him from the streets of Manhattan to a chamber of 32 doors. In this episode, the group explores sides three and four of the epic concept album; will Rael ultimately flee to safety … or stay behind to help his brother John? Spoiler alert: “Hey John!”
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I really enjoyed these episodes. My interpretation of the meaning of The Lamb is that Rael is reborn and, in going through a maturation process, he struggles to find meaning and identity — representing what we all go through. He’s born in In The Cage, has the process of childhood socialization foreshadowed in Grand Parade, and then tries to find himself through intimate relationships (Counting Out Time) and spiritual awakening (Carpet Crawlers, Chamber of 32 Doors). These paths lead him nowhere, so he contemplates death (Lilywhite Lilith, Anyway, Supernatural Anaesthetist). Where I lose the thread is with The Lamia. It may just be a device to get Rael to the Colony of Slippermen and, ultimately, to The Ravine, where he has to choose between self and another (John).
I disagree with most (or all?) of the TG group in that I think It is absolutely essential to the story. We do need clarification on Rael’s exclamation of “it’s not your face, it’s mine!”. That statement, along with the lyrics in It, convey that the true meaning of life is unity — that ultimately, Rael and John and all of us and everything are all part of a unified universe.
One other comment…I was really surprised no one dug into Steve’s solo in The Lamia. It is one of my favorite parts of any Genesis song. So beautiful and heart-wrenching.
Thanks for another great examination if a Genesis album. My only disappointment was that no one did a Lamb–El Topo exegesis. 😉
I love this album, and this pair of podcasts has been worth waiting for.
I respectfully disagree with what seems to be the TG team’s opinion – and also many fans’ opinion – about the 3rd and 4th sides of the album. I do think the album has higher and lower points, but I don’t think there is a drop-off in quality towards the end at all. Moreover, if you are following the narrative, that last part is absolutely essential. I find “In the Rapids” to be the emotional peak of the story, and that line “It’s not your face, it’s mine” is heart-wrenching. To anyone familiar with the Christian ethos, and particularly the book “Pilgrim’s Progress” by John Bunyan, the parallels with the Christian doctrine could not be any plainer. “Brother” is clearly meant here in the sense of fellow human, who could be anybody, rather than being Rael’s literal sibling.
I also love “It”, though I would be happier if they had come up with a ways to give it a conclusion rather than fading it out.
I agree with Al Melchior that all the numbers are needed. But I also agree that the last sequence of numbers in the Lamb is very uneven — it’s an unpainted part of a house that was never finished. Gabriel was trying to finish the Genesis equivalent of “Tommy” or “Quadrophenia” or “Jesus Christ Superstar” or “Aqualung.” They were operating under extreme pressure, and Hackett and Banks had to help finish out the material for Gabriel. All the accounts of the period agree on this point.
As for “It,” here’s what Kevin Holm-Hudson says in his book-length study of The Lamb (pp. 94-95):
“In the 1960s and early 70s, organized religion went into something of a decline and was largely supplanted by individual, eclectic approaches to spirituality. Early in the twentieth century, however, a colleague of Williams James prefigured the spiritual outlook of the 1960s with his conception of an ‘Absolute Reality’ behind all phenomena, recounted as follows:
although I had ceased by childish prayers to God, and never prayed to It in a formal manner, yet my more recent experience shows me to have been in a relation to It which practically was the same thing as prayer. …. I now recognize that I used to fall back for support upon this curious relation I felt myself to be in to this fundamental cosmical It.
Jung writes that when “the summit of life” is reached [allusion to Nietzsche]:
“One becomes Two,” and the greater figure, which one always was but which remained invisible, appears to the lesser personality with the force of a revelation … . The long expected friend of his soul, the immortal one, has now really come … .
Such a moment occurs when Rael brings John to the water’s surface and sees his own face on John’s body. This event recalls William James’s discussion of the resolution of what he called the “divided self” ….
https://www.amazon.com/Genesis-Broadway-Ashgate-Popular-Music/dp/0754661474/
However, I also agree that the tune does sound a bit like game show music. It even has a little disco feel to it. I think that was deliberate. It was to sound, if not cheesy, then at least more fun and pop, after a long struggle. It’s the fun coda at the end of many classical works.
BTW, there is a close musical relationship between “It” and the opening of “Watcher of the Skies.” Listen carefully.
Have any of you seen The Lamb Lies Down of Broadway Illustrated? I think it is done very well and made me understand and rediscover the album. And that led me to this podcast.
As far as my interpretation goes, I think it’s about the Last Judgement.
https://youtu.be/JszTrQdL314
Tom here – I think we’re all aware of the video and it looks amazing. Perhaps in our current climate we’ll find time to watch the whole thing! 🙂
Dear TT,
Continuing to work my way through your terrific podcasts in these post apocalyptic times. The 2 Lamb episodes were very enjoyable indeed. I may be alone in thinking that there is in fact a real consistency to the overall album. It is an epic full bhoona, utterly immersive listening experience that rewards further with every listen. A real highlight of the whole 1970’s, from any band, not least a bunch of 24 year olds! For me among many many highlights are Fly on a Windshield, 32 Doors and Hairless Heart, but the absolute pinnacle is The Lamia; a masterpiece; maybe even their single best song ever.
Toodle pip.
This podcast talks openly about something occasionally embarrassing, which is how _much more serious and important_ this stuff all used to be. Because it could t be Good or just What I Like without being profound. Thanks for that. And everything else of course.
“It”…yes It’s sort of stuck on at the end, but I always thought it was another Genesis don’t-take-it-al-too-seriously song that said simply: in the end, Rael is a dick.
I’m sure I had read somewhere at one time that the “it” was the essence of self in like Zen Buddhism or something like that. I can’t seem to find it online now, but in this regard, it is indeed an essential song on the album. Rael has been on a spiritual journey and has has finally reached the “it”. I also recall an interview with Gabriel where he mentions his interest in Eastern religions. The Lamb is full of references to many religions. I think Gabriel was trying to find his identity in terms of spirituality and that’s what the Lamb is about. I think he concluded that something more closely related to Buddhism makes the most sense to him.
Also, in reference to whether the story is chronological, I think it is, with the exception of Back in NYC, Hairless Heart, and Counting Out Time. I think there, they take a break to give you a little insight into the protagonist and then Carpet Crawlers continues the journey. After all, the line “for my second sight of people, they’ve more lifeblood than before” refers to the Grand Parade. He went from lifeless bodies to now living beings.
I don’t think Gabriel wastes many words in the lyrics. It’s very dense. It is genius, in my opinion. He was 24!
Would love if you guys revisited the Lamb and just talked about the lyrics!!! I actually wrote an essay about it at one time, and the article below is worth the read. It would be great if you had a call-in show where listeners could give their opinions. Together, maybe we’d crack this thing!!
article https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/the-ulysses-of-concept-albums
What? No mention of all the links to that weird-ass movie “El Topo?” (I’ve only watched the trailer to the movie, but now I can’t un-see what I have seen.)
Listening to your podcast over two episodes, it occurs to me that there is something extraordinary about, virtually, EVERY song on the entire album. If it’s not Gabriel’s lyrics, then it might be how he sings the song, or Banks’ keyboard solo, or Phil’s drumming, or…how the lyrics fit into the whole story…or everything that’s going on. I’ve been listening to this album for over 30 years or so, and sometimes I think I know what the whole thing means, but more often than not, I don’t.
To me, it’s their best album. Those first two sides are approximately on par with the whole of “Supper’s Ready” – so, 2 “Suppers” are better than 1. It’s unfortunate that “The Waiting Room” takes so long to get to its greatness because it interrupts the flow that had already existed for 50 minutes, or whatever. I still like the rest of side 3 – and this podcast kind of reminded me of how great a song like “Supernatural Anaesthetist” is – but something gets lost in that experimentation and it’s never quite found again.
What I really thought was cool is how you brought up that “The Light Dies Down On Broadway” could very well have been the proper end of the album. I never thought of that but I think it works a whole hell of a lot better than “it.” I’ve never liked “it” as an ending – there is nothing about the song “it” that sounds like it belongs on this album.
Have you ever watched the YouTube video by Nathaniel Barlam? He animates the whole album – I think it’s a phenomenal viewing experience and would highly recommend it to all of you. It even helped make sense of a lot of things that had passed by me.
It ranks right up there with “Quadrophenia” and “The Wall” as being among THE greatest albums of all time.
I really started to get into Genesis in probably 79/80. I had a friend at school who was obsessed and he was convinced that the Lamb was the best thing that Genesis had ever produced. At the time I was really into Nursery Cryme and Foxtrot (Musical Box still probably my all time favorite Genesis track). I really tried to get into the Lamb but rarely made it past side 2. Recently due to Tabletop Genesis I have gone back to the Lamb and I have to say I have ‘discovered’ a love for the deepcuts inside 3/4. There are elements of the Lamb that are possibly the best sections of music that Genesis ever produced. I don’t care for the lyrics but I can see past that.
“I don’t care for the lyrics.” Then you don’t understand the album.